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Malik Thomas

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I'm surprised nobody mentioned quarterly estimated taxes yet! If you're making money from self-employment, you might need to make quarterly tax payments to avoid penalties. The IRS expects you to pay taxes throughout the year, not just at filing time.

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NeonNebula

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Quarterly taxes for a 16yo mowing lawns seems excessive. IRS isn't going after kids for missing quarterly payments on small amounts. In my experience, filing annually is fine for teen side jobs unless they're making serious money (like $10k+).

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Carmen Diaz

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As someone who went through this exact situation a few years ago, I can share what worked for me. First, yes you do need to report this income since you're over the $400 threshold for self-employment. But don't stress too much about the bank deposits - for amounts under $10k, they typically won't question where the cash came from. Here's what I wish someone had told me: start keeping better records NOW. Create a simple spreadsheet with dates, jobs, and payments. Also track your expenses like gas, equipment, supplies - these deductions can significantly reduce what you owe. I ended up saving about $400 in taxes just by deducting my lawn mower, gas, and maintenance costs. For filing, you'll use Schedule C and Schedule SE along with Form 1040. The self-employment tax is about 15.3%, but you might not owe income tax depending on your total income. Since your parents claim you as a dependent, you still need to file your own return. Consider it good practice for adult life! Most tax software can handle this situation, or you might want to have your parents help you through it the first time.

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Serene Snow

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This is really helpful advice! I'm in a similar situation but only made about $2,800 doing dog walking and pet sitting. Do the same rules apply even if I'm under the $5,200 amount mentioned in the original post? And how detailed do my records need to be - like do I need to write down every single walk or can I just track weekly totals?

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Dyllan Nantx

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This has been such an eye-opening discussion! I'm in a very similar boat - making about $85k and consistently getting $2,800-3,200 refunds each year. I never really thought about it as giving the government an interest-free loan until reading through these comments. I'm definitely going to try the approach of putting the standard deduction amount ($14,600 for 2024) in Step 4(b) of my W-4. That seems like the most straightforward solution for someone like me with a single job and no itemized deductions. Quick question for the group - if I make this change now in late 2024, will it cause any issues with my withholding being too low for the remainder of the year? Should I calculate a prorated amount based on remaining pay periods, or is it safe to use the full annual standard deduction amount even if I'm making the change partway through the year? Thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences - this community is incredibly helpful for navigating these tax complexities!

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Great question about making the change mid-year! You're right to think about the timing. Since we're in late 2024, you'll want to be a bit careful about putting the full $14,600 standard deduction amount on your W-4 right now. The withholding system will spread that deduction reduction across your remaining pay periods, which could result in too little being withheld for the short time left in the year. Instead, you might want to calculate a smaller amount for the rest of 2024, then update your W-4 again in January 2025 with the full standard deduction amount. For example, if you have 4 pay periods left in 2024, you might only put about $2,400-3,000 in Step 4(b) to avoid underwithholding. Then in January, submit a fresh W-4 with the full $15,000 standard deduction for 2025 (the amount typically increases each year). Alternatively, you could just wait until January to make the change and get the full benefit for all of 2025. That might be the safest approach to avoid any surprises when you file your 2024 return!

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This thread has been incredibly helpful! I'm dealing with a similar overwithholding situation - making about $102k and getting back around $4,200 each year. One thing I wanted to add for anyone considering these adjustments: make sure to factor in any life changes that might happen during the year. I made the mistake last year of adjusting my withholding in March, then got married in September and completely forgot to update my W-4 again. Even though my spouse and I file separately, the change in filing status affected my tax situation. Also, for those mentioning the IRS Withholding Estimator - I found it works much better if you have your most recent pay stub and last year's tax return handy when you use it. The tool asks for pretty specific information about year-to-date earnings and withholdings. One last tip: if your employer uses a payroll service like ADP or Paychex, you can often submit W-4 changes online through their employee portal, which tends to process faster than paper forms through HR.

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Mateo Silva

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Thanks for mentioning the life changes factor! That's something I hadn't considered. I'm actually planning to get married next year, so I'll need to remember to revisit my W-4 when that happens. Quick question about the online payroll portals - do you know if changes submitted through those systems still follow the same 30-day processing rule that @Mateusius Townsend mentioned earlier? Or do they typically get implemented faster since they re'electronic? Also, for anyone else following this thread, I just wanted to mention that I finally bit the bullet and used the IRS Withholding Estimator today. It recommended putting $12,800 in Step 4 b(for) my situation which (is less than the full standard deduction amount, probably because of my income level and tax bracket .)The tool was actually much easier to use than I expected once I had my pay stub in front of me.

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Maya Jackson

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Another option to consider is filing separately from your spouse. If your spouse has significant income but few deductions, while you have business losses or lots of deductions, filing separately might help. But be careful! Filing separately has drawbacks like losing certain tax credits.

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This is actually not great advice for most people. Filing separately usually results in a higher total tax bill. The standard deduction gets cut in half, and you lose access to several valuable credits. Plus with self-employment, filing separately rarely helps since business expenses are deducted before you even get to the filing status decision.

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Emma Davis

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As someone who went through this exact same confusion when I first became self-employed, I can tell you it gets much clearer once you understand the flow. Here's the simple breakdown: 1. First, calculate your business profit on Schedule C: $135,000 revenue - $120,000 business expenses = $15,000 net business income 2. Then, on your main tax return (1040), you'll have that $15,000 as self-employment income plus any other income you and your wife have 3. Finally, you choose standard deduction ($27,700) vs itemized deductions. Since $15,000 - $27,700 = $0 taxable income, standard deduction wins unless you have huge personal deductions One important thing others mentioned: you'll still owe self-employment tax on that $15,000 (about $2,120), but your income tax would be $0. Don't overthink it - business expenses and personal deductions are completely separate things in the tax system. Your business expenses always get deducted first on Schedule C, then you decide standard vs itemized for personal stuff.

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Sean Doyle

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This is such a helpful breakdown! I'm also new to self-employment taxes and was getting overwhelmed by all the different forms and schedules. Your step-by-step explanation makes it so much clearer - I didn't realize business expenses and personal deductions were handled at completely different stages of the process. Quick question though - when you mention the self-employment tax of about $2,120 on the $15,000, is that something that gets calculated automatically when you file, or do you need to do that calculation separately? I'm using tax software but want to make sure I'm not missing anything.

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Beth Ford

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Something I haven't seen mentioned yet is the impact of Net Investment Income Tax (NIIT) on your decision. As a single filer, you'll pay the 3.8% NIIT on investment income once your modified AGI exceeds $200,000. This applies to pass-through income from an LLC but NOT to income retained within a C Corp. Given that you're already in the 22% bracket and expecting to move to 24%, you're likely approaching or exceeding the NIIT threshold. This means your effective rate on LLC pass-through income could be 24% + 3.8% = 27.8%, making the 21% corporate rate even more attractive. However, you still need to factor in the eventual double taxation when you take distributions. If you're truly planning to reinvest profits for years, the C Corp structure might make sense despite the accumulated earnings tax concerns. Just make sure you have a clear business purpose for the retained earnings and document it well. Another consideration: C Corps can carry forward capital losses indefinitely, while individual taxpayers are limited to $3,000 per year in capital loss deductions. If you're doing active trading, this could be significant.

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Lia Quinn

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This is exactly the kind of comprehensive analysis I was looking for! The NIIT calculation really changes the math - I hadn't fully considered that 27.8% effective rate on LLC income vs the 21% corporate rate. One question about the capital loss carryforward benefit you mentioned - if I'm doing mostly short-term trading, wouldn't most of my losses be ordinary losses rather than capital losses? Or does the C Corp structure somehow convert trading losses to capital losses that can be carried forward more favorably? Also, regarding documenting business purpose for retained earnings - what kind of documentation would satisfy the IRS? Is it enough to have a written investment policy stating the corporation's growth strategy, or do they expect more detailed justification for each year's retained profits? The indefinite capital loss carryforward could be huge if I have a bad trading year early on. That alone might justify the C Corp structure even with the double taxation risk down the road.

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Dmitri Volkov

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Great questions! Regarding loss treatment - you're right to think about this carefully. For C Corps engaged in trading, the losses would generally still be ordinary business losses, not capital losses. The key advantage isn't about converting the character of losses, but rather that C Corps can carry forward ordinary business losses indefinitely (subject to certain limitations), while individual traders face the $3,000 annual limit on capital loss deductions against other income. However, if your C Corp is classified as an "investment company" rather than actively trading, then the losses would be capital losses with the indefinite carryforward benefit I mentioned. The distinction between trader vs investment company for C Corps follows similar but not identical rules to the individual trader vs investor determination. For documenting retained earnings business purpose, you'll want more than just a general investment policy. The IRS expects specific, reasonable business needs for the retained funds. Examples include: documented plans for expanding trading capital to take advantage of larger opportunities, maintaining cash reserves for margin requirements, funding technology upgrades or research tools, or accumulating funds for specific investment strategies that require substantial capital. Annual board resolutions explaining the business reasons for retention, along with supporting financial projections, are typically recommended. The key is showing the retention serves the business rather than just avoiding personal taxes.

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Mateo Lopez

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Building on the excellent points about NIIT and loss carryforwards, there's another angle worth considering: the potential for C Corp tax rate changes. While the current 21% rate is attractive, corporate tax rates have historically been more volatile than individual rates. If you're planning a long-term strategy of retaining earnings in the corporation, you're essentially betting that corporate rates will remain favorable. Also, don't overlook the practical complexity of operating a C Corp for investment activities. You'll need separate books and records, potential quarterly estimated tax payments at the corporate level, and annual corporate tax returns (Form 1120). The compliance costs can add up quickly - typically $2,000-5,000 annually in professional fees depending on your activity level and complexity. One hybrid approach I've seen work well for some traders is starting with an LLC structure to keep things simple initially, then converting to C Corp status once the investment activity and profits reach a level where the tax benefits clearly outweigh the additional complexity and costs. The conversion can be done tax-free under certain circumstances, giving you flexibility to adapt as your situation evolves. Have you calculated the break-even point where the C Corp tax savings would exceed the additional compliance and operational costs?

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Vanessa Chang

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That's a really practical perspective on the compliance costs and complexity. I've been so focused on the tax rate differences that I hadn't properly factored in the ongoing operational expenses. $2,000-5,000 annually in professional fees could easily wipe out tax savings in the early years when profits might be modest. The hybrid approach you mentioned is intriguing - starting with LLC simplicity and converting later. Do you happen to know what the typical threshold is where people make that conversion? Is it based on annual profits, total assets under management, or some other metric? Also, regarding the tax rate volatility risk you mentioned - that's something I hadn't considered but it's a valid concern. Given the current political climate, locking into a C Corp structure based on today's 21% rate could backfire if corporate rates increase significantly in the coming years. At least with pass-through taxation, any rate changes would affect me the same whether I'm operating through an entity or individually. This conversation has really helped me realize that maybe I should start simple with an LLC (without S-Corp election initially) and focus on building consistent profits before getting too fancy with the structure. The conversion option gives me a safety valve if the numbers eventually justify the additional complexity.

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Nasira Ibanez

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Emma, based on everything discussed in this thread, December seems like the clear winner for your situation! With you earning $16K more than your partner would have made, plus having kids, you're looking at potentially $2,500-$3,200 in tax savings by filing jointly vs. your current head of household status. A few practical next steps I'd suggest: 1. **Run the numbers yourself** - Try the IRS Interactive Tax Assistant tool mentioned by Amina, or one of the tax comparison tools others have recommended. This will give you concrete numbers for your specific situation. 2. **Don't forget the timing advantage** - Getting married in December means you'll receive that tax refund in early 2025 instead of waiting until 2026. With a stay-at-home parent situation, having that extra cash flow sooner could be really valuable. 3. **Plan for withholding changes** - As Josef and others mentioned, update your W-4 immediately after marriage! Since you returned to work recently, your current withholdings are probably set for single status, and marriage will change that calculation. 4. **Check state taxes** - If you're in a state with income tax, make sure to factor that in too. Some states treat married couples differently than the federal system. The December wedding looks like a smart financial move, plus you get to start your married life together sooner. Congratulations and best of luck with whatever you decide!

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Michael Adams

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This is such a helpful summary, Nasira! As someone new to this community, I'm amazed at how thorough and practical all the advice has been. Emma's situation really resonates with me since I'm also navigating major life changes and trying to make smart financial decisions. The point about getting the refund a year earlier is something I never would have considered on my own - that cash flow timing could make such a difference, especially when adjusting to life with one income. And the reminder about updating the W-4 immediately after marriage seems like such an easy thing to forget but could cause real problems later. Thanks to everyone who shared their real experiences and specific dollar amounts - it makes the decision so much clearer when you can see actual examples rather than just general advice. This thread has been incredibly educational for someone just starting to think about these kinds of financial planning decisions!

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Natasha Petrova

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This has been such an incredibly helpful discussion! As someone who works in financial planning, I wanted to add one more consideration that might be relevant for your situation, Emma. Since you mentioned returning to work just 2 months ago after your partner became a stay-at-home parent, you might want to look into the Dependent Care FSA (Flexible Spending Account) for next year if your employer offers it. If you get married in December 2024, you'll be filing jointly for the 2024 tax year, but you can also plan your 2025 benefits enrollment as a married couple. The Dependent Care FSA allows you to set aside up to $5,000 per year (for married filing jointly) in pre-tax dollars specifically for childcare expenses. Since you have kids and might need occasional childcare even with a stay-at-home parent (date nights, appointments, etc.), this could provide additional tax savings on top of the marriage benefits everyone else has calculated. Also, if your employer offers dependent health insurance coverage, getting married in December means your partner and kids could potentially be added to your plan during the next open enrollment period, which might be more cost-effective than separate coverage. Between the immediate tax savings, earlier refund timing, and potential benefits planning advantages, December really does seem to align with your goal of making the smartest financial choice. Best wishes for your upcoming wedding!

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