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Another option to consider is filing Form W-4V to elect voluntary additional withholding. If they won't change their method, you could potentially offset their excessive withholding by claiming more allowances. Not ideal, but might help mitigate the overwithholding problem. Also, if this continues, you might want to adjust your quarterly estimated tax payments to account for the expected refund. This could help with your cash flow throughout the year rather than waiting for a large refund.
Wouldn't filing Form W-4V only work for certain government payments? My NQDC is from a private employer. And for the quarterly estimated payments - wouldn't I potentially face underpayment penalties if I reduce them too much, even if I know I'll get a big refund later?
You're absolutely right about Form W-4V - I misspoke. For employer payments, you'd use a regular Form W-4. My apologies for the confusion! Regarding estimated tax payments, you're also correct to be concerned about underpayment penalties. However, the IRS has a "safe harbor" provision - if you pay at least 90% of the current year's tax or 100% of the prior year's tax (110% if your AGI exceeds $150,000), you won't face penalties. So you could potentially use last year's tax liability as your guide for this year's payments, taking into account the expected overwithholding from your NQDC distribution.
Has anyone considered that the employer might actually be required to withhold at this rate? I work in payroll (different industry) and sometimes supplemental wages above certain thresholds have mandatory withholding requirements that can't be adjusted, especially for high-income earners. Just wondering if this might be a compliance thing rather than a mistake.
That's not accurate for NQDC distributions. While there are mandatory withholding rates for some supplemental wages (like bonuses), NQDC distributions definitely allow for either the aggregate method or the flat rate method. The issue here is that the employer is choosing the method that creates an artificially high withholding rate by annualizing a single payment. The mandatory withholding for supplemental wages over $1 million is 37%, but that's only for the portion above $1M. For someone receiving $165k annually, that's not even relevant.
One workaround I found in FreeTaxUSA last year for my wife (Chinese student with treaty benefits) was to use the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion (Form 2555) instead of trying to find a tax treaty specific option. It's not technically the correct form, but it accomplishes the same thing - excluding certain foreign-sourced income from taxation. The software walks you through it much better than trying to do manual adjustments on Schedule 1.
Isn't this potentially risky from an audit perspective? Using the wrong form even if the end result is similar seems like asking for trouble...especially since Form 2555 is for US citizens/residents living abroad, not for foreign citizens in the US claiming treaty benefits.
You raise a good point about audit risk. After thinking about it more, I wouldn't recommend my approach. While it worked in terms of getting the correct tax amount calculated, it's definitely not the right way to claim treaty benefits. The IRS could rightfully question why Form 2555 was used when the requirements weren't met. The proper approach is definitely what others have suggested - report the income, then use Schedule 1 with a negative adjustment and proper treaty reference. Sometimes taking shortcuts leads to bigger problems later!
Has anyone else just given up on FreeTaxUSA for international student situations? I switched to Sprintax last year after dealing with this exact problem and it was worth the extra money. They have all the tax treaty options built right in and handle both 1040 and 1040-NR situations.
Just to add another data point - I had to withdraw from my 401k last year and yes, the 20% federal withholding is standard. But I actually had to pay MORE at tax time because that 20% wasn't enough to cover my actual tax bracket once the distribution was added to my other income. If you're normally in the 15% bracket, the extra $12,000 could potentially push some of your income into a higher bracket. Don't assume you'll get money back - might want to set aside a bit more just in case.
Thanks for pointing that out! I hadn't considered that the additional 12k might push me into a higher bracket. Do you think I should make an estimated tax payment to be safe?
Based on your situation, making an estimated tax payment might be smart, especially if the $12,000 pushes your total income significantly higher than normal. If you want to play it safe, you could calculate roughly how much additional tax you might owe beyond the 20% already withheld and make a quarterly estimated payment. This would help avoid any potential underpayment penalties when you file. Better to be prepared than surprised with a tax bill you weren't expecting.
Random question - did your 401k provider give you any options about the withholding? When I took a hardship withdrawal they let me choose whether to have taxes withheld or not.
That's not actually correct for 401k withdrawals. The 20% federal withholding is mandatory for 401k plans - administrators are required by law to withhold it. You might be thinking of an IRA withdrawal, where withholding IS optional. Big difference between the two account types regarding withholding rules.
Don't forget about self-employment taxes! Even though your business is showing a loss now, once you start making money, you'll need to pay both the employer and employee portions of Medicare and Social Security taxes (15.3% total) on your net profit. This is ON TOP OF your regular income taxes. I learned this the hard way with my side business. First year I made actual profit, I got hit with a surprise tax bill because I wasn't setting aside enough for the SE tax portion.
Thanks for the reminder about self-employment taxes! That's definitely good to know for when (hopefully) my business starts turning a profit. Is there any threshold I need to hit before I have to start paying those taxes? Like a minimum profit amount?
Yes, there's a small threshold - you only have to pay self-employment tax if your net earnings from self-employment are $400 or more during the year. So once your business starts making more than $400 in profit, that's when you'll need to start paying these taxes. It's also worth noting that once you start making profit, you might need to make quarterly estimated tax payments to avoid underpayment penalties. A lot of side business owners don't realize this until it's too late and end up owing penalties their first profitable year.
Make sure you're tracking everything properly for the home office deduction if you're working from home. There are two methods - the regular method (calculating actual expenses based on the percentage of your home used for business) and the simplified method ($5 per square foot up to 300 square feet). I use the simplified method for my etsy shop because it's less paperwork, but if you have a dedicated space that's a large portion of your home, the regular method might save you more.
Amina Toure
Another approach that worked for our county agency was contacting our state's tax department. Since they also have to comply with Pub 1075 for their IRS data sharing agreement, they had already created a modified template that addresses the 2021 requirements. They were happy to share their template with us after we signed an NDA. Many state tax departments have dedicated Safeguards Coordinators who work on this compliance full-time and might have better resources than what's publicly available.
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Dmitry Ivanov
ā¢That's a smart approach I hadn't considered. Did your state make substantial changes to the template format, or did they just add sections for the new requirements? I'm trying to gauge how different the new SSR should look.
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Amina Toure
ā¢They kept the same general structure of the 2016 template but expanded several sections. The most significant changes were in the areas covering cloud environments, remote access, and encryption requirements. They also added entirely new sections for container security, mobile device management, and the updated incident response procedures. The nice thing about their template is that they clearly marked which requirements were from the 2021 revision, making it easy to see what's new. The overall document ended up being about 20% longer than the old template due to the additional controls.
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Oliver Zimmermann
One important thing to note about Pub 1075 compliance for 2021 that hasn't been mentioned yet - they've significantly changed how they want agencies to handle virtual environments and cloud computing. If you're using any cloud services like AWS, Azure, or Google Cloud to process or store FTI, there are completely new requirements that weren't in the 2016 revision. The SSR needs to specifically document how your cloud environment meets requirements like FedRAMP authorization and data segregation.
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CosmicCommander
ā¢This is a huge issue for us too. We're moving some systems to Azure GovCloud and trying to figure out exactly what needs to be in the SSR about it. Does anyone know if IRS accepts the FedRAMP authorization package as evidence, or do we need to document all the controls separately?
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