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Just a heads up to anyone filing Form 1065 - the deadline for calendar-year partnerships is March 15th, not April 15th like individual returns. I learned this the hard way last year and got hit with late filing penalties. Don't make my mistake!
You can file for an automatic 6-month extension using Form 7004 if you need more time. Just remember that the extension only gives you more time to file, not more time to pay any taxes owed (though partnerships themselves don't typically pay tax).
I went through this exact same situation last year with our 5-partner consulting business! After trying a few different options, here's what I learned: First, definitely avoid the super expensive professional software unless you have really complex allocations. For most small partnerships, you don't need to spend $500+ on Drake or UltraTax. I ended up using TaxACT Business after comparing it with H&R Block and TaxSlayer. TaxACT was around $200 for the business package and handled our Form 1065 and K-1 generation without any issues. The e-filing process was straightforward - just had to create an account, enter our partnership info, and the software walked me through each section. One tip: make sure you have your partnership's EIN ready and double-check that all partner SSNs are correct before you start. I made a typo on one partner's SSN and it caused our initial e-file to get rejected, which was stressful with the March 15th deadline approaching. The software automatically generates all the K-1s once you complete the main 1065 form, and you can print or email them directly to your partners. Much easier than I expected!
This is really helpful! I'm in a similar boat with our 4-partner partnership and was getting overwhelmed by all the different software options. The TaxACT Business recommendation is exactly what I needed - something that's not crazy expensive but still handles the e-filing properly. Quick question about the EIN - did you need to have any special paperwork or documentation ready when setting up the e-filing, or was it just the EIN and partner info? I want to make sure I have everything prepared before I start so I don't run into any delays like you mentioned. Also really appreciate the heads up about double-checking the SSNs. That's exactly the kind of mistake I could see myself making when I'm rushing to meet the deadline!
Great question! Your understanding is mostly correct. As a US tax resident, you generally don't owe US taxes on the premiums you pay or the policy's cash value growth while you're just maintaining the policy. You're also correct about including it on your FBAR since the cash surrender value exceeds $10,000. However, there are a few additional considerations: 1. **Form 8938 (FATCA reporting)** - You may also need to report this on Form 8938 if your total foreign financial assets exceed the filing thresholds (generally $50,000 for single filers living in the US, higher for married couples). 2. **Policy structure matters** - Make sure your policy qualifies as legitimate life insurance under US tax principles. If it's heavily investment-focused or has unusual features, it could potentially be treated as a PFIC (Passive Foreign Investment Company), which would trigger additional reporting and tax complications. 3. **Future tax events** - You're right that taxation typically occurs when you cash out the surrender value or take distributions. The death benefit to your beneficiaries generally wouldn't be taxable to them as US income. Given the complexity of international tax issues, it might be worth having a tax professional review your specific policy to ensure you're meeting all reporting requirements correctly.
This is really helpful, thank you! I'm new to dealing with foreign financial assets and the reporting requirements seem overwhelming. Could you clarify what happens if I've been missing the Form 8938 filing? I've been diligent about FBAR but only recently learned about FATCA reporting. Also, regarding the PFIC determination - is there a specific ratio or threshold that determines when a life insurance policy crosses into PFIC territory? My policy does have some investment options but the death benefit is still the primary component.
@Ella Lewis Great questions! For missed Form 8938 filings, you have a few options. If the failure was due to reasonable cause and not willful neglect, you might be able to file late returns without penalties. The IRS also has programs like the Streamlined Filing Compliance Procedures for taxpayers who weren t'aware of their filing obligations. I d'recommend consulting with a tax professional to determine the best approach for your situation. Regarding PFIC determination for life insurance, there isn t'a single bright-line test, but the IRS generally looks at whether the policy is primarily insurance or primarily investment. Key factors include: the death benefit to cash value ratio, whether you can direct investments within the policy, and the policy s'overall structure. A traditional whole life or term life policy with modest cash value growth typically won t'be a PFIC, but variable or universal life policies with significant investment components might be. The determination really depends on the specific policy features and how it s'structured under your home country s'laws.
One aspect that hasn't been covered yet is the potential impact of tax treaties. Since you mentioned you're a foreign national from your home country, there might be a tax treaty between the US and your country that could affect how your life insurance policy is treated. For example, some tax treaties have specific provisions for life insurance that can provide beneficial treatment or clarify reporting requirements. The treaty might also affect whether certain income from the policy would be taxable in the US versus your home country. Additionally, if you ever decide to move back to your home country while maintaining US tax residency (like keeping your green card), you'll want to understand how the substantial presence test and treaty tie-breaker rules might affect your obligations. I'd suggest looking up the specific tax treaty between the US and your home country - Publication 901 from the IRS lists all current treaties. This could potentially simplify your situation or provide additional protections you might not be aware of.
This is an excellent point about tax treaties that I hadn't considered! I'm actually from Japan, and I know there's a US-Japan tax treaty, but I've never looked into whether it has specific provisions for life insurance. Do you know if there's a way to determine which specific articles of a tax treaty apply to life insurance policies? I've tried reading through some treaty language before and it can be pretty dense. Also, since I'm maintaining my green card but might eventually return to Japan for work, understanding those tie-breaker rules could be really important for my long-term planning. Thanks for bringing this up - it sounds like I need to do some homework on the treaty provisions!
I'm confused about something slightly different but related. Does the order of withdrawals matter? Like if I take money from my 401k first and then later from my Roth, does that affect how my Social Security gets taxed compared to taking them in a different order?
Yes, the order absolutely matters! This is actually a key part of retirement withdrawal strategy. Taking taxable distributions from your 401k will increase your adjusted gross income, which could push more of your Social Security benefits into the taxable range. Many financial planners suggest being strategic about which accounts you draw from in which years. Sometimes it makes sense to take Roth distributions (which don't affect your provisional income) during years when you might otherwise cross those taxation thresholds for Social Security.
This is exactly the kind of confusion that trips up so many people planning for retirement! The "nontaxable interest" terminology is misleading because it sounds like it shouldn't matter if it's not taxed. Here's a simple way to think about it: The IRS wants to capture your true economic capacity when deciding how much of your Social Security to tax. So even though municipal bond interest isn't subject to federal income tax, it still represents money flowing into your pocket that increases your ability to pay taxes. Your Roth IRA situation is different - qualified distributions (including growth) from a Roth IRA are completely excluded from the provisional income calculation. This makes Roth accounts incredibly valuable for retirement tax planning, especially if you're concerned about Social Security taxation. One thing to keep in mind: while Roth distributions don't count, any traditional IRA or 401k distributions DO count as part of your adjusted gross income in this calculation. So if you have both types of accounts, you can be strategic about which one you withdraw from each year to manage your provisional income and potentially reduce how much of your Social Security gets taxed.
This is such a helpful breakdown! I'm new to thinking about retirement taxes and this whole thread has been eye-opening. I had no idea that municipal bonds could actually work against you for Social Security taxation - that seems so counterintuitive since they're "tax-free." Your point about being strategic with traditional vs Roth withdrawals is really interesting. Is there a rule of thumb for how to decide which account to tap first? I'm still years away from retirement but want to start planning now.
Have you: ⢠Checked your transcript for codes? ⢠Verified if you have credits subject to PATH Act? ⢠Confirmed your filing was actually accepted on Jan 31st (not just submitted)? ⢠Called the automated refund hotline at 800-829-1954? The 21-day timeline is just a guideline, not a guarantee.
The confusion between business days vs calendar days is completely understandable! As others have mentioned, the IRS does count business days for their 21-day processing guideline, which excludes weekends and federal holidays. However, I want to point out something that might help clarify the mixed information you're receiving: the IRS website itself states that "9 out of 10 refunds are issued within 21 days" without always specifying business vs calendar days in their general communications. This creates the confusion you're experiencing. For your January 31st filing date, counting 21 business days with Presidents Day excluded would indeed land you around February 29th. I'd recommend checking your account transcript online at irs.gov - it will show any processing codes that might explain delays beyond the standard timeline. The transcript is often more informative than the Where's My Refund tool.
This is really helpful clarification! I'm new to filing my own taxes and had no idea there was a difference between how the IRS communicates their timelines versus how they actually calculate them internally. The transcript suggestion is great - I didn't even know that was available online. Is there a specific code I should be looking for that would indicate normal processing versus a hold or review?
Isabella Martin
One thing nobody's mentioned yet - what's the actual benefit you're trying to achieve with this structure? If it's just liability protection, there might be simpler ways to structure this. I had a Revocable Trust -> LLC structure for my business initially, and it was a huge headache for taxes. I ended up restructuring to simplify things. If it's for estate planning, have you considered whether a SMLLC owned by one spouse (with appropriate estate planning) might achieve your goals with less complexity? Or potentially an irrevocable trust structure if you're looking for asset protection?
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Evelyn Kim
ā¢The main reason we set it up this way was for probate avoidance and simplified transfer if something happens to either of us. We have young kids and wanted to make sure the business could continue operating smoothly if either of us passed away unexpectedly. We did consider having just one of us own the LLC, but since we both actively work in the business, we wanted the structure to reflect our actual roles. The revocable trust seemed like a good solution for keeping everything under one umbrella, but I'm definitely open to simplifying if this creates unnecessary tax complexity.
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Isabella Martin
ā¢That makes sense for probate avoidance, but you might be overcomplicating things. A revocable trust can own business interests directly without needing the LLC layer in between if you're mainly concerned about probate. If you want liability protection AND probate avoidance, you might consider having the LLC owned directly by you and your wife (as joint tenants with right of survivorship or as tenants by the entirety if Georgia allows it), then creating transfer on death provisions in your operating agreement that specify how ownership transfers. This would still provide liability protection while simplifying the tax structure. For business continuity with minor children, you could include specific succession planning provisions in your operating agreement and potentially use life insurance held in an irrevocable trust to provide liquidity. I'd recommend consulting with an estate planning attorney who specializes in business succession planning - they might be able to suggest a cleaner structure that accomplishes your goals without creating tax filing complexity.
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Levi Parker
Based on everything discussed here, it seems pretty clear that you'll need to file Form 1065 for your LLC. The consensus from multiple experienced folks is that the IRS will look through both disregarded entities (your revocable trust and the SMLLC) and see two ultimate beneficial owners in a non-community property state. I'd suggest getting this confirmed officially before filing, especially since you mentioned this is your first year with this structure. The penalty risks for filing incorrectly on partnership returns can be significant. Also, for next year's planning, you might want to evaluate whether this structure is still serving your needs. From what you've described about wanting probate avoidance and business continuity, there might be simpler ways to achieve those goals without the Form 1065 complexity. An estate planning attorney who works with business owners could probably show you some alternatives that accomplish the same objectives with cleaner tax reporting. Good luck with your filing - and congratulations on the successful Amazon FBA business!
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Nia Jackson
ā¢This is really helpful - thank you for summarizing everything so clearly! As someone who's been lurking on tax forums trying to figure out similar issues, it's great to see such a thorough discussion with practical advice. One quick follow-up question for the group: if they do end up filing Form 1065, are there any specific things to watch out for in terms of how to allocate the income between the spouses on the K-1s? Since they're both actively working in the business, I assume it would be 50/50, but I'm wondering if there are any nuances with the trust ownership structure that might affect this. Also, @4d3a8e299772, have you considered whether you need to make quarterly estimated payments differently now that you're potentially moving from Schedule C to partnership taxation? The timing and calculation might be slightly different.
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