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I'm still confused about the practical side of tracking all this. I place hundreds of bets throughout the year on different apps. Am I really expected to log every single one manually? That seems insane.
Most of the major betting apps/sites have an option to download your annual betting history as a CSV or PDF. Usually under Account ā History ā Tax Documents or something similar. I download mine quarterly so it's easier to manage. Then I just use a spreadsheet to separate wins and losses.
That's super helpful, thanks! I didn't realize you could download everything like that. Definitely going to check that option on my apps.
Just want to add a quick tip for anyone dealing with this - make sure you keep records of your deposit and withdrawal amounts too, not just individual bets. The IRS considers your "session" winnings and losses, so if you deposit $500, bet it all on various games, and cash out $800, that $300 difference is what matters for tax purposes in many cases. But you still need the detailed bet-by-bet records to support your calculations. Also, don't forget about any bonuses or free bets you received - those count as income when you use them, even if you didn't deposit your own money. I learned this the hard way when I got audited and had to explain $2,000 in "mystery" winnings that were actually from signup bonuses I'd forgotten about. The key is being consistent in your record-keeping method. Whether you track every single bet or go by session totals, just make sure you can justify your numbers if the IRS comes asking.
This is really valuable info about the session-based tracking! I had no idea bonuses counted as income when used. Quick question - if I received a $100 free bet bonus but only won $50 when I used it, do I report the $100 bonus as income or just the $50 actual winnings? And do I get to deduct anything for the "loss" on the free bet portion?
Just wanted to add another perspective on the MPF withdrawal taxation. I handled a similar situation for my client who moved from Hong Kong to the US in 2022. One thing that often gets overlooked is that you may need to file Form 8938 (Statement of Specified Foreign Financial Assets) if your MPF account balance exceeded certain thresholds before withdrawal. Even though you've withdrawn the funds, the IRS still wants to know about foreign accounts you held during the tax year. Also, regarding the timing of when you received the funds versus when your employer made their final contribution - the IRS generally uses the "constructive receipt" principle. Since you couldn't access the funds until February 2024, that's likely when it becomes taxable income for US purposes, regardless of when the employer contribution was made. Make sure to keep detailed records of the Hong Kong taxes (if any) withheld from your MPF withdrawal, as this will be crucial for claiming the Foreign Tax Credit. The documentation from your MPF provider should show any withholding taxes that were deducted.
This is really helpful information about Form 8938 - I had no idea about that requirement! Quick question: do you know what the threshold amounts are for filing Form 8938? I'm trying to figure out if my MPF balance would have triggered this requirement. Also, when you mention "constructive receipt," does that mean the February 2024 date is definitely when I should report this income, even though the employer contribution happened in November 2023? I want to make sure I get the timing right since this affects which tax year I need to file this under.
For Form 8938, the threshold depends on your filing status and where you live. For US residents filing jointly, it's $100,000 on the last day of the tax year or $150,000 at any time during the year. For single filers, it's $50,000/$75,000 respectively. Since your MPF was around $85,000 HKD (roughly $11,000 USD), you probably wouldn't meet the threshold. Regarding constructive receipt, yes - February 2024 is when you should report it since that's when you actually had access to and received the funds. The November 2023 employer contribution doesn't matter for US tax timing purposes because you couldn't withdraw it then. So this will go on your 2024 tax return, not 2023. Also worth noting - make sure to convert the HKD amount to USD using the exchange rate on the date you received the funds (February 2024), not when the contribution was made.
I went through a very similar situation when I moved from Hong Kong to the US in 2022, so I can share some practical insights from my experience. First, you're absolutely right to be concerned about the tax treatment. The IRS will treat your MPF withdrawal as ordinary income since the US doesn't recognize the MPF as a qualified retirement plan. This means it gets taxed at your regular income tax rates, not capital gains rates. One thing I learned the hard way is that you should definitely look into whether Hong Kong withheld any taxes from your MPF withdrawal. Many people don't realize that Hong Kong may have deducted some taxes at source, especially if you had any employer contributions that hadn't fully vested. If they did, you can potentially claim a Foreign Tax Credit on Form 1116 to offset some of your US tax liability. Regarding the Roth IRA question - unfortunately, you can't directly roll over MPF funds into a Roth IRA since the IRS doesn't consider it a qualified foreign pension plan. However, if you have earned income in the US in 2024, you could potentially use some of the withdrawal money to fund a Roth IRA contribution (up to the annual limits), though this would be considered a regular contribution, not a rollover. Make sure to keep all your MPF withdrawal documentation, including any foreign tax forms, as the IRS may want to see proof of the foreign taxes paid if you claim the credit.
Thanks for sharing your experience! This is really helpful since you went through the exact same situation. I have a couple of follow-up questions if you don't mind: 1. How did you figure out if Hong Kong withheld any taxes from your MPF withdrawal? Did your MPF provider give you specific documentation about this, or did you have to request it separately? 2. When you filed Form 1116 for the Foreign Tax Credit, did you run into any issues with the IRS accepting Hong Kong taxes as creditable? I've heard mixed things about whether all foreign taxes qualify. 3. For the currency conversion, did you use the exchange rate from the day you received the funds, or did you use some kind of average rate for the month/year? I'm trying to get all my documentation in order now so I don't scramble when it's time to file. Your practical insights are much more helpful than the generic advice I've been finding online!
Great question! You're absolutely right to be concerned about underwithholding with multiple jobs. I went through something similar last year and learned the hard way that each employer withholds taxes assuming they're your only income source. For your specific situation, I'd definitely recommend: 1. **For your W-2 jobs**: Update your W-4 forms and check the "multiple jobs" box in Step 2. This will increase your withholding rate to account for your higher total income. 2. **For your contract position**: Set aside 25-30% of that income immediately. You'll owe both regular income tax AND self-employment tax (15.3%) on this income since no taxes are being withheld. 3. **Consider quarterly payments**: Since you're earning $1,920/month from your contract work (assuming 20 hours Ć $24), you'll likely need to make quarterly estimated payments to avoid underpayment penalties. The IRS withholding estimator tool is really helpful for calculating exactly how much extra to withhold or pay quarterly. Also, keep detailed records of all your income and any business expenses related to your contract work - those expenses can reduce your taxable income. Better to overpay slightly and get a small refund than to owe thousands plus penalties!
This is really comprehensive advice! I'm curious about the quarterly payment timing - when are those due dates throughout the year? I want to make sure I don't miss any deadlines and get hit with penalties. Also, is there a minimum amount you need to owe before penalties kick in?
Great question about the quarterly payment deadlines! The due dates for 2024 estimated tax payments are: - Q1 (Jan-Mar): Due April 15, 2024 - Q2 (Apr-May): Due June 17, 2024 - Q3 (Jun-Aug): Due September 16, 2024 - Q4 (Sep-Dec): Due January 15, 2025 For 2025, they'll follow a similar pattern but watch for weekends/holidays that might shift the exact dates. Regarding penalties, you generally won't face underpayment penalties if you owe less than $1,000 when you file, OR if you've paid at least 90% of the current year's tax liability, OR at least 100% of last year's tax liability (110% if your prior year AGI was over $150,000). Since you mentioned the contract work brings in about $1,920/month, that's roughly $23,000 annually just from that source. Even at a conservative 25% tax rate, you'd be looking at around $5,750 in taxes on that income alone - well above the $1,000 threshold. Definitely worth making those quarterly payments to stay ahead of it!
You're definitely smart to think ahead about this! I was in a very similar situation a couple years ago with multiple W-2 jobs plus freelance work, and I ended up owing about $2,800 at tax time because I didn't plan properly. Here's what I wish I had done from the start: **For your W-2 jobs:** Fill out new W-4 forms with both employers and check the "multiple jobs" box in Step 2. This tells them to withhold at a higher rate. You can also request additional withholding on line 4(c) if needed. **For your contract work:** This is where you need to be most careful. Set aside 30% of every contract payment immediately - don't touch that money! Contract work means you're paying both the employer and employee portions of Social Security and Medicare taxes (15.3% total) PLUS regular income tax. **Track everything:** Keep detailed records of all income and any business expenses related to your contract position. Things like mileage, supplies, home office space, etc. can reduce your taxable contract income. The IRS withholding estimator is your best friend here - plug in your expected income from all three sources and it'll tell you exactly how much you should be setting aside or having withheld. Since you're making good money from multiple sources, you'll likely need to make quarterly estimated payments to avoid underpayment penalties. Better to be safe than sorry!
This is excellent advice! I'm actually in a similar boat with multiple income sources and was wondering - when you say to set aside 30% of contract payments immediately, do you put that in a separate savings account or just keep track of it mentally? I've been trying to stay disciplined about this but sometimes I dip into those funds when money gets tight. Any tips for keeping that tax money truly separate and untouchable until payment time?
Absolutely open a separate savings account specifically for tax money! I learned this lesson the hard way after "borrowing" from my tax savings multiple times and then scrambling to replace it. I opened a high-yield savings account at a different bank than my main checking account - this creates just enough friction that I won't casually transfer money out. I set up automatic transfers for 30% of each contract payment to go directly into this account within 24 hours of getting paid. Some people even go as far as opening an account at an online-only bank without a debit card, so accessing the money requires a few days for transfers. The key is making it inconvenient enough that you won't touch it impulsively. I also track it in a simple spreadsheet with columns for: Date, Contract Payment Amount, Tax Amount Set Aside, Running Total. Seeing that running total grow actually becomes motivating, and it helps me estimate what I'll owe for quarterly payments. Trust me, the temporary inconvenience of having that money "locked away" is nothing compared to the stress of owing thousands to the IRS with no money saved to pay it!
One thing nobody's mentioned is how this affects your ability to claim the Child Tax Credit if you have kids. If you use the FEIE, you can't claim the refundable portion of the CTC on the excluded income. So if you have children, you might actually be better off with the FTC in some cases. For example, I live in France with 2 kids and about ā¬70,000 in income, plus some US dividends. When I ran the numbers, the additional Child Tax Credit I could claim using FTC outweighed the tax savings from the partial FEIE strategy. Has anyone else with children done detailed calculations on this? Would be interested to see if this holds true across different income levels and number of dependents.
Great point about the Child Tax Credit! I have 3 kids and live in Japan, and this is exactly why I use the FTC instead of FEIE. With the increased CTC amount ($2,000 per qualifying child with up to $1,500 refundable), it makes a huge difference. I think the break-even point depends on your income level, foreign tax rate, and number of children. In my experience, if you have 2+ kids and are in the lower income brackets (under $100k combined), the FTC often works out better because of the refundable credits. Has anyone found a good calculator that factors in all these variables? Most tax software doesn't seem to handle this comparison very well.
This is such a valuable discussion! I'm a US citizen living in Australia and have been struggling with this exact decision. Reading through everyone's experiences, I'm realizing I need to factor in more variables than I initially thought. @Emily Nguyen-Smith and @James Johnson - your point about the Child Tax Credit is huge. I have one child and was leaning toward the partial FEIE strategy, but now I'm wondering if I should stick with FTC to preserve my ability to claim the full CTC. One question for the group: has anyone dealt with superannuation (retirement contributions) in Australia and how that interacts with these strategies? My employer contributes about AUD $8,000 annually to my super, and I'm not sure how that affects the foreign earned income calculation for FEIE purposes. Also wondering about the interaction with the Additional Child Tax Credit - if I use partial FEIE and keep some earned income for Roth IRA eligibility, does that preserved earned income count toward the ACTC calculation even though the rest is excluded? This thread has been incredibly helpful - it's clear there's no one-size-fits-all answer and the optimal strategy really depends on your specific situation including state taxes, number of dependents, and foreign tax rates.
Welcome to the community @Avery Davis! Your situation with Australian superannuation is actually quite complex and I'm glad you brought it up. For superannuation contributions, the employer contributions (Superannuation Guarantee) are generally not considered part of your foreign earned income for FEIE purposes since they're not directly received by you in the tax year. However, any salary sacrifice contributions you make would reduce your foreign earned income dollar-for-dollar, which could affect your FEIE calculation. Regarding the Additional Child Tax Credit with partial FEIE - yes, any earned income you preserve (don't exclude) would count toward the ACTC calculation. So if you exclude $80k but keep $20k as earned income for Roth IRA purposes, that $20k would be available for ACTC calculations. This is actually one of the strategic benefits of partial FEIE that isn't widely discussed. Given Australia's relatively high tax rates and your child, I'd strongly recommend running both scenarios (FTC vs partial FEIE) with your specific numbers. The interaction between Australian taxes, US credits, and superannuation can create some surprising results. You might want to consider using one of the tax analysis tools mentioned earlier in this thread to model both approaches comprehensively.
Savanna Franklin
Has anyone used a CPA who specializes in rental property? That part of my taxes always confuses me with depreciation and repairs vs improvements.
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Juan Moreno
ā¢I use Howard Gittelman in NJ (works remotely with clients nationwide). He specializes in real estate investors and has saved me thousands on my rental properties. He knows all the depreciation tricks and how to maximize deductions for repairs vs. capital improvements. Worth every penny!
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Olivia Garcia
I'm in a really similar situation - self-employed with rental income and my spouse has a side business too. After years of doing my own taxes and worrying I was missing things, I finally bit the bullet and hired a CPA who specializes in small business and real estate. One thing I'd definitely recommend is asking potential CPAs about their process for year-round planning, not just tax prep. The CPA I work with sends me quarterly reminders about estimated payments and checks in before major financial decisions to discuss tax implications. That proactive approach has been worth its weight in gold. Also, don't be afraid to interview a few different CPAs before choosing. Most will offer a brief consultation to discuss your situation and their services. I talked to three before finding the right fit - someone who explained things clearly and seemed genuinely interested in helping me optimize my tax strategy rather than just filling out forms. The investment has paid for itself through better organization, strategic planning, and peace of mind. Good luck with your search!
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Emma Anderson
ā¢This is exactly what I needed to hear! I've been doing my own taxes for years but I'm definitely at the point where the complexity is overwhelming me. The quarterly check-ins sound really valuable - I always forget about estimated payments until it's too late. How did you find CPAs to interview? Did you just search online or get referrals? I'm worried about ending up with someone who doesn't really understand the nuances of freelance work combined with rental property income.
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