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doesn't anyone else think its crazy that we gotta jump through all these hoops for some tax savings?? i'm flipping houses in florida and just use an LLC, keep it simple. my buddy went S-corp and now he's spending like 5 hrs a month just on paperwork. not worth it imho unless ur making big $$$.
It's definitely a pain, but if you're saving $10k+ in taxes, that's worth a few hours of paperwork each month. I've been doing the S-Corp thing for 3 years and honestly it's not that bad once you get systems in place. Most of my buddies in real estate who are making six figures with their flips all go S-Corp.
Great discussion everyone! As someone who's been flipping properties for about 5 years now, I can confirm that the S-Corp election sweet spot is usually around $75k-100k+ in annual profit. Below that, the administrative burden often outweighs the tax savings. One thing I'd add is timing - if you're just starting out and not sure about your profit levels, you can always begin with a regular LLC and make the S-Corp election later when your business grows. Just remember the election deadline is March 15th (or within 75 days of forming your LLC if it's a new entity). Also, don't forget about state taxes! Some states don't recognize S-Corp elections or have additional fees/taxes for S-Corps. In my state (California), there's an additional $800 franchise tax for S-Corps regardless of income, which needs to be factored into your calculations. For those flipping 3-4 properties annually with $60k-75k profit per property like the OP, you're definitely in the range where S-Corp election could make sense, but I'd strongly recommend running the numbers with a tax professional first.
This is really helpful advice! I'm actually in a similar situation to the OP - just getting started with flipping and trying to figure out the best approach. The timing aspect you mentioned is something I hadn't really considered. It's reassuring to know that I can start with a regular LLC and switch later once I have a better sense of my profit levels. One question - when you say "run the numbers with a tax professional," are you talking about a full consultation or just a quick review? I'm trying to balance getting proper advice with keeping my startup costs reasonable while I'm still figuring out if this business model will work for me long-term.
I completely understand your frustration! I went through the exact same thing with our small condo association last year. The good news is that your situation is actually much simpler than you think - you're just using the wrong form. Based on what you've described (member contributions for shared expenses like water/sewer), your condo trust almost certainly qualifies to file Form 1120-H instead of Form 1041. This form was specifically designed for homeowners associations and small condo associations like yours. Here's why 1120-H would be perfect for you: - Your $9,000 in member contributions would be "exempt function income" (completely tax-free) - The $8,200 water/sewer expenses are fully deductible - The $85 bank fees are also fully deductible - You'd only pay taxes on investment income (which you don't have) at a flat 30% rate To qualify, you need 60% of income from member dues (you're at 100%) and 90% of expenses for property maintenance (water/sewer clearly qualifies). You make the election simply by filing 1120-H instead of 1041 - no separate paperwork needed. This would eliminate all your confusion about where numbers go on the 1041 because the 1120-H is designed specifically for situations like yours. I wish someone had told me this before I spent hours wrestling with trust accounting principles that don't really apply to condo associations!
This is exactly the kind of clear explanation I needed! I've been banging my head against the wall trying to figure out trust accounting when apparently I should be looking at homeowner association rules instead. One quick clarification - when you say I make the election "simply by filing 1120-H instead of 1041," does that mean I can just abandon my partially completed 1041 in TaxAct and start fresh with 1120-H? Or do I need to somehow notify the IRS that I'm switching forms for this tax year? Also, since this is our first year filing (we just formalized our arrangement in 2024), would there be any issues with starting with 1120-H right away, or should I stick with 1041 for consistency and switch next year?
Yes, you can absolutely abandon your partially completed 1041 and start fresh with Form 1120-H! There's no need to notify the IRS separately about the switch - the election is automatic when you file the 1120-H form. Since this is your first year filing, you're actually in the perfect position to start with 1120-H right away. There's no "consistency" requirement that would force you to use 1041 first. In fact, starting with the correct form from the beginning will save you headaches down the road. The beauty of the Section 528 election is its flexibility - you can make it year by year just by filing the appropriate form. Many small condo associations like yours discover 1120-H after struggling with 1041 for years and wish they'd known about it sooner. Just make sure to double-check your organizing documents to confirm you're structured as a condo association rather than a for-profit entity, but based on your description of member contributions for shared maintenance expenses, you almost certainly qualify. Your situation sounds textbook perfect for 1120-H treatment.
I've been helping small condo associations with their tax filings for years, and you're absolutely right to feel frustrated - Form 1041 really wasn't designed for simple condo maintenance situations like yours. The consensus in this thread about Form 1120-H is spot on. Your situation is actually a textbook case for Section 528 treatment: 100% of income from member assessments, expenses clearly for property maintenance, and a straightforward two-unit structure. One additional tip that might help: when you do switch to Form 1120-H, keep detailed records of your qualifying expenses. The IRS occasionally audits small associations, and having clear documentation that your expenses are for "exempt function" purposes (like your water/sewer bills) makes everything smooth sailing. Also, don't feel bad about the confusion with TaxAct - most commercial tax software is terrible for HOAs and condo associations because we're such a niche market. The software assumes you're a traditional trust with beneficiaries, complex distributions, etc., when really you're just neighbors sharing utility bills. Make the switch to 1120-H and you'll wonder why anyone ever told small condo associations to file 1041s in the first place!
This is such valuable information! I've been doing my own taxes with TurboTax for years but always stress about whether I'm missing deductions or making mistakes. The fact that VITA has trained volunteers AND a quality review process actually sounds more thorough than what I get doing it myself. One question - do they handle situations where you have multiple W-2s from different jobs during the year? I switched jobs in 2024 and have two W-2s, plus I contributed to both a traditional and Roth IRA. Would that be considered too complex for VITA or is that pretty standard stuff they can handle? Also wondering about timing - when do these programs typically start taking appointments for the current tax season? I always like to file early to get my refund quickly.
Multiple W-2s and IRA contributions are definitely within VITA's scope! That's pretty standard stuff they handle all the time. I had a similar situation a couple years ago with three different W-2s from job changes plus retirement contributions, and the VITA volunteer handled it without any issues. For timing, most VITA sites start taking appointments in late January/early February once they receive their tax documents and volunteers complete their annual certification training. Some sites even start advertising appointment availability in mid-January. I'd recommend checking the IRS VITA locator website starting around January 20th to find sites near you and see when they begin scheduling. The early bird approach is smart - not only do you get your refund faster, but appointment slots are much easier to get in February compared to the March/April rush. Plus the volunteers tend to have more time to spend with you when it's not super busy!
I wish I had known about VITA years ago! I've been paying H&R Block around $300 every year for what's essentially a basic return - just my W-2, some student loan interest, and the standard deduction. Reading through everyone's experiences here, it sounds like VITA would have been perfect for my situation and saved me thousands over the years. The quality review process actually gives me more confidence than some of the chain tax prep places where you never know if you're getting someone experienced or a seasonal worker who just finished their training. The fact that these are volunteers who choose to help their community rather than employees trying to upsell services is really appealing. I'm definitely going to look into this for next year's taxes. For anyone else on the fence - it seems like the worst case scenario is you find out your situation is too complex and you're back where you started, but the potential savings and peace of mind from the quality review process make it worth trying. Thanks to everyone who shared their experiences!
Another quirk to be aware of - qualified dividends! If your synthetic long crosses an ex-dividend date, any dividend equivalents you effectively receive aren't eligible for qualified dividend tax treatment. With actual share ownership, you can get the preferential qualified dividend tax rate if you meet the holding period requirements. But with a synthetic long, you're technically not receiving dividends - you're just seeing the options prices adjust to account for the dividend. So any dividend benefit gets taxed as ordinary income through the options pricing.
Wait what? How does the dividend even work with a synthetic long? You don't actually own the shares until expiration/assignment, so you wouldn't get any dividend payment, right?
You're absolutely right - with a synthetic long, you don't receive actual dividend payments since you don't own the shares. What happens instead is that the options prices adjust on the ex-dividend date to reflect the dividend. Specifically, both the call and put strike prices get reduced by the dividend amount, and if you're holding American-style options, there might be early assignment risk on the short put if the dividend is large enough. The "dividend equivalent" I mentioned refers to how the net value of your synthetic position changes - it should theoretically increase by roughly the dividend amount, but that gain gets captured through the options pricing rather than as a separate dividend payment. This is why it doesn't qualify for the preferential dividend tax rates - you're not actually receiving dividends, just capital appreciation on your options position.
This is a great discussion on a complex topic. One thing I'd add is that the IRS has been increasingly scrutinizing synthetic positions in recent years, especially when traders use them to manufacture tax losses while maintaining economic exposure to the underlying asset. The wash sale treatment that @Andre Lefebvre mentioned is definitely the correct approach for scenario 2. What many people don't realize is that the IRS views the entire synthetic long strategy as a single integrated transaction, not separate option trades. This is why timing the individual legs differently doesn't necessarily help you avoid wash sale treatment. I'd also recommend keeping very detailed records of your synthetic positions, including the dates opened, premiums paid/received, and your intent when entering the strategy. If you get audited, being able to demonstrate that this was part of a legitimate investment strategy (rather than tax loss harvesting) will be important. The key principle to remember is that tax treatment should follow economic substance. Since a synthetic long has the same risk/reward profile as owning shares outright, the IRS expects the tax consequences to be similar as well.
This is really helpful context about the IRS viewing synthetic positions as integrated transactions. I'm curious though - what constitutes "detailed records" in practice? Beyond the basic trade data, should I be documenting things like market conditions when I opened the position, or my investment thesis? And how do you prove "legitimate investment strategy" versus tax loss harvesting if the economic outcome is identical either way?
Andre Laurent
Ugh I got audited last year and this exact issue came up. My advice is to take photos of ALL receipts where you claimed business expenses and store them digitally by date. I had to go through hundreds of receipts during my audit and the ones I couldn't find or that were too faded to read were automatically disallowed as deductions.
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Emily Jackson
ā¢What app do you recommend for storing receipt photos? I've been just taking regular photos but they get mixed in with everything else.
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Mei Wong
ā¢I use Google Drive and create a folder for each tax year, then subfolders by month. When I take receipt photos, I rename them with the format "YYYY-MM-DD_StoreName_Amount" so they're easy to search later. The Google Drive app lets you scan documents directly which creates cleaner PDFs than regular photos. Plus it's all backed up automatically so you never lose anything.
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Freya Nielsen
Great thread! I'm dealing with this exact same situation with my freelance graphic design work. One thing I learned from my accountant is that you should also keep a simple business expense log alongside your receipts. Just a spreadsheet with columns for date, vendor, total amount, business portion, and business purpose. This way if you ever get audited, you're not just relying on highlighted receipts - you have a clear paper trail showing your thought process for each deduction. The IRS loves documentation that shows you were being deliberate and organized rather than just guessing. Also, don't forget that you can deduct the business portion of things like gas when you're making those mixed shopping trips! If you drove to Target specifically to buy business supplies but also grabbed personal items while there, you can still claim the mileage as a business expense.
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Oliver Brown
ā¢This is really helpful advice about keeping a business expense log! I just started my own small business this year and have been pretty disorganized with tracking expenses. Do you have a template for that spreadsheet you mentioned? I'm worried I might be missing some important columns or categories that could help during tax time. Also, I had no idea about being able to deduct mileage for mixed-purpose trips - that's actually a pretty big deal since I do a lot of shopping runs where I pick up both business and personal stuff. Is there a minimum threshold for how much of the trip needs to be business-related, or can you claim it as long as there was some legitimate business purpose?
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